Kevin’s Conversations: How They Get Away With It…

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14 Responses

  1. bob1 says:

    Good thoughts, Kevin!

    I tend to think that the “parachurch” groups might be more susceptible to this kind of thing. Many (not all) are personality-led.

    At least traditionally, the local church for the large part wasn’t that focused on the pastor/leader. Sure, if you have a lousy preacher, you might complain and switch churches, I suppose.

    Of course in the end, it boils down more than anything to individual behavior. But the environments we find ouselves in play a role, too.

    If you surround yourself with synchophants, guess what is likely to happen?

    I do believe that accountability is utterly crucial. What also helps is if someone on a board has the courage to point out when the leader has gone astray. That’s not easy.

  2. Kevin H says:

    Thanks, bob1.

  3. The New Victor says:

    This is sadly endemic of family systems. The members shift and adjust to preserve the system. DV and sexual abuse is hidden or denied by families, and members of alcoholic families adjust likewise. From the RCC, to the secular BSA. I would argue that public schools enable bullying by punishing victims.

  4. Muff Potter says:

    They get away with it because we let them.
    There’s big money in the CIC (christian industrial complex).

  5. Pineapple Head says:

    They usually leave us clues. Little red flags. We just miss them or ignore them.

  6. JD says:

    A quick quote from Oswald Chambers – November 9th
    My Utmost for His Highest

    “What a wonderful personality! What a fascinating man! Such marvelous insight! What chance has the Gospel of God through all that? It cannot get through, because the line of attraction is always the line of appeal. If a man attracts by his personality, his appeal is along that line; if he is identified with his Lord’s personality, then the appeal is along the line of what Jesus Christ can do. The danger is to glory in men; Jesus says we are to lift Him up”

  7. jtk says:

    I haven’t heard anyone defending Ravi, have you?

    This should be encouraging along the lines of this post.

    Is that because Ravi died? Because the evidence was so clear and voluminous?

  8. Kevin H says:


    I haven’t heard anyone defending him, so on one hand that is encouraging, but on the other hand, I believe it would be a very different story if he were still alive.

    If he were still alive, I believe it is likely he still would be deflecting and manipulating and using his power to protect himself and it would have been mostly status quo of those around him to keep supporting him. The evidence became so clear and voluminous once the investigators were able to get a hold of some (not even all) of his electronic devices. When Ravi was alive, there was little to no effort to take or audit his electronic devices and I believe that would have continued if he were still alive.

    Additionally, the spa allegations were spurred by his funeral when one of the spa workers who had been abused by Ravi had trouble handling his funeral seeing all the praise and adoration of the man when she had experienced his very dark side. This prompted her to share her story and started to open the floodgates. Without the funeral, all the spa and massage therapist abuse may still be tightly under wraps.

  9. Tim says:

    JTK, the broad strokes of what has been coming out about Ravi have been circulating for years, and very little of it connected until after he died.

    You aren’t hearing people defending him now because there is nothing to be gained from it, but there absolutely were efforts to downplay and deny the allegations that were swirling around him over the last 4 or 5 years.

  10. Kevin H says:


    After reading Tim’s comment, I should clarify my statement that I haven’t heard anyone defending Ravi. That is only since the devastating report that was released a week or two ago. Before that, yes, I saw plenty of people defending Ravi, even as the evidence and allegations grew greater and greater.

  11. Linn says:

    As long as Christians are into celebrities, we will continue to see scandal, unless ministries continue to put strong Scriptural and ethical guidelines around the leadership. When you have someone whose board is stacked with family members and friends who see no wrong, when the “brand” becomes more important than truth about sin, when people are not answerable for their actions (traveling masseuse? apartments in Bangkok? massage parlors? 4 cell phones?), when followers refuse to believe that the leader may not be above reproach (you haven’t read Rom 3:23?), these situations will continue to happen.

    And yet, the majority of the pastors and other Christian leaders I have sat under have been humble folk who serve their flocks well, often denying themselves in the process. That gives me hope, but they are also not part of the cult of Christian celebrity. We need to to leave the cult of Christian celebrity behind.

  12. jtk says:

    So it’s not the volume of evidence, it’s what certain organizations do, how they respond, that perpetuates abuse?

    Once again, I ask, who repents and apologizes for past mistakes?

  13. jtk says:

    “once again” because I’ve asked previous times.

    I can’t think of any on a large scale.

  14. Jennifer Johnson says:

    sadly, this article is written from the same vantage point and appears to have the same agenda of those who you are accusing. As someone who is one of those “left a wake of countless broken and victimized souls in their self-indulgent trails”, I read this article to be some source of encouragement. Instead I was given a ‘to-do’ list, and told how to think….very cultish, just like those you accuse. The church has done nothing for me or others who got caught up in the ‘culture of christianity’. No healing has been offered, no deprogramming…..I have only had to do that myself. That is quite sad. And seriously…did you have to through politics in this article?!?!

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