Free Saeed

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79 Responses

  1. Em says:

    what is posted here today reveals a woman of character – a character that is being molded by our real and living God – joining her in praying for Saeed as she requests

  2. Josh the Baptist says:

    I know this isn’t a good thing to say, but I feel like I’ve been lied too for 3 years.

  3. Josh the Baptist says:

    I feel like if the initial call had been “Help me get this wife-beater out of jail”, the response would have been much different.

  4. Xenia says:

    I am not assuming that he is a wife -beater.

    We haven’t heard his side of the story yet.

  5. Josh the Baptist says:

    Well, he’s a wife-beater, or she’s a liar. Either way, the response would have been different.

  6. Michael says:

    Should it have been?

    If someone is a sinner do we leave them imprisoned unjustly?

    If the allegations are proven, then I wish him the worse.
    We won’t know until he’s free.

  7. Josh the Baptist says:

    Sorry, it kills the sympathy I once felt.

  8. Josh the Baptist says:

    It’s pounded in our heads to believe the victims, and she has doubled down so I believe her. I saw her say today that if he gets out, there will be pastoral oversight to make sure she doesn’t get beaten again. I guess that’s good, but if it is bad enough that she is still worried about it after three years, I’m in no hurry for him to be back in the house.

  9. Michael says:

    I believe her too.
    I also believe that it’s a separate issue from his imprisonment.

  10. Josh the Baptist says:

    Maybe, and again, I’m sorry because I know this is the support thread, but I’ll mention this week and never speak of it again. I can’t get behind a wife-beater. There are thousands of guys over there losing their heads for their faith. I will turn my attention to them. I feel bad for Saeed’s kids. They have a bad dad. Hopefully, prison in Iran will put some sense in his head, and when he gets out (whether that’s 1 year or 5 years) he will be a better dad. As for Nagmeh, she owes him nothing.

  11. Michael says:

    Josh,

    I think it’s worth discussing.
    I had some ear for those who think she is lying to protect her children from threatened harm.
    Her doubling down on this leaves a lot of room to doubt that theory.

  12. Josh the Baptist says:

    That was my theory. This proves me wrong. Some of her comments in the discussion on facebook are heartbreaking. I believe she was abused.

  13. Em says:

    “Those chains that have stuck to him from the culture he was raised in (Middle East) and from his former religion (Islam). I believe that God will use Saeed’s imprisonment to break Saeed of these chains and to refine him and use him as a vessel for the work that He has prepared for him.”
    i, for one, am willing to let Naghmeh’s assessment stand – if we are honest with ourselves we all have ingrained behaviors from how we were raised – thank God, most of us weren’t raised to defend our delusional honor with brute force (even apart from religion i think it is more common in much of the old school Mediterranean nations than is admitted)
    pray for Saeed as she requests … IMNSHO
    besides if he gets back to Boise with a bad attitude, Al will deal with him 🙂

  14. Kevin H says:

    I do believe these recently revealed issues should be separate from Saeed’s imprisonment. I still do advocate for Saeed’s release.

    That being said, I have had similar feelings as Josh as shared and I’m sure there are others here in the same boat. It’s one thing to recognize that we’re all fallen and shouldn’t be that surprised when we find out the supposed dirt on somebody. But the accusations of spousal abuse from the woman who had been so out front and advocating for his release for 3 years was surely a punch in the gut.

    And then there were other things like finding out that they have been apparently communicating through Skype when our impression for the past 3 years was that the only way that she or her kids could communicate with Saeed was in passing letters back and forth during those infrequent times that his parents got to visit him in prison. And on top of the claims of abuse, that somehow the abuse had gotten worse since he’s been in prison. So the situation as a whole just has a general feel like we had been lied to or are being lied to currently or some combination of both, at least in some perspectives. It does, at the very least, put a big hit on your enthusiasm.

  15. Michael says:

    Josh,

    I just went over there and read that thread.
    I need to take a step back and rethink this.
    Those are not the comments of a woman who is lying.
    Thank you for risking the disapproval of others to speak.

  16. Michael says:

    Kevin H,

    There are some very disturbing, difficult, questions that don’t seem to have answers at this point.

    I’m very troubled at the moment.

  17. Paige says:

    We don’t have to figure it out. We get to pray. That’s all and that’s enough.

    God works in mysterious ways, His wonders to perform, so the old saying goes… and perhaps, just perhaps, the time spent in prison will be life changing in more ways than we imagine.

    I have imagined him being pretty messed up. Somehow, he is still, apparently, alive. Is it possible that God orchestrated his imprisonment? I’ve wondered that myself.

    Perhaps being on the receiving end of abuse will change his outlook on dishing it out. It’s all sick and sad. They are in my prayers….. the kids too.

    It’s a horrible enough mess as it is, but living it in public and being analyzed and criticized by the ‘peanut gallery” makes it even worse.

  18. Jean says:

    I want to offer my comments only as a citizen of the U.S.A. I object to letting our citizens rot in prison in an enemy nation on trumped up charges. I would not have signed the nuclear deal without Abedini’s release, along with any other American political prisoners.

    At this point, I would not implement any sanctions release and would put maximum pressure on Iran to obtain their release.

    I don’t care what Abedini is alleged to have done in his private life, he can face justice/reconciliation/restitution here in the U.S.A.

    This is simply unacceptable.

  19. Soldier of Jah says:

    I don’t care how much ministry someone does it means nothing if you are abusing your wife or husband or kids.

  20. Babylon's Dread says:

    How can someone feel that a man should be beaten and tortured in prison for over three years and we should remove our advocacy because of an accusation of heinous sin. If he is an ordained pastor where is the requirement of more than one witness.

    Something is wrong with this story and with our response.

    I think it is time to treat the whole matter like an open question and investigate.

  21. Michael says:

    “I think it is time to treat the whole matter like an open question and investigate.”

    Just how do you propose and who do you propose do this investigation?

    Whoever would be stupid enough to try to get to the truth on this will pay for it dearly.

  22. Babylon's Dread says:

    Saeed Abedini is paying dearly now and having people suggest that his present punishment fits his unsubstantiated crime.

  23. Michael says:

    I’m not touching this one.
    First off, he’s a Calvary Chapel guy and a political hero.
    I was reminded again last week how nasty some CC people get when you touch one of the anointed.
    Second, you are getting in deep with the victims rights movement which has already made it’s position clear.

    Third, his wife keeps doubling down…

    There’s a lot wrong with this story and I probably know more wrong about it than most…but it isn’t going to be resolved until he’s back.

  24. Josh the Baptist says:

    I do want to make clear, I hope those convicted to advocate continue to do so. My concious will no longer let me.

  25. Michael says:

    Josh,

    I can do it based on Jean’s #19 which has merit.
    I confess that I have problem turning merit into passion.
    I further confess that I think there’s some very dark things yet to be revealed in this mess.

  26. Babylon's Dread says:

    Josh,

    You are a minister … the scripture do not allow your position. You are advocating a position that would destroy every minister on the planet. You are taking a position that says an elder is guilty if accused. Now I am a bit riled and may have to stick my don’t give a d@mn nose into this.

  27. Michael says:

    Who can testify to spousal abuse beside the spouse?
    Are we to interrogate the children who this may have been hidden from?
    Do you think that CC Boise is going to answer inquiries on this?

    They can’t ethically in the first place and they wouldn’t anyway.

    That leaves us with these choices;

    Naghmah is telling the truth.
    Naghmah is lying.
    Naghmah is lying, but with a noble purpose.

  28. Babylon's Dread says:

    Michael,

    My point is that scripturally there is no reason to accept the accusation though it may be true. There is certainly no reason for believers to violate scripture and violate our own jurisprudence to judge a man guilty and condemn him without hearing the matter.

    Your points are true as they stand. Josh’s stance is untenable on this one but he gets to live his conscience. We may have been taken down a rathole.

  29. Jean says:

    I think what BD may be thinking (and I am too) is that the time for adjudication is not now. In addition, even if the allegations are proven, do we know whether the pastor is contrite?

    The spouse wants her husband released. Would you deny her her desire by withholding support for his release?

  30. Em says:

    three choices? no there’s a fourth – admittedly it is hard to pick up a sticky mess and lift it up to God… but we don’t have to touch it to cover it with prayer, to pray that the devil will be neutralized in every aspect

    or so it seems to me… sometimes short prayers are just as effective as long duty call prayers, i think – dunno

  31. Michael says:

    Em, Jean…well said by both of you.

    Jean, I think the difference is in the fervency of advocasy.
    I’ve put some effort into this…more at some times than others, but trying to be faithful.

    There is a big…really big…part of me that doesn’t give a hoot in hell what happens to wife or child abusers.

    That may well be wrong or graceless, but it’s also true.

    This is a very difficult situation to parse.

  32. Babylon's Dread says:

    Let me agree with MichaelI hate abuse and deplore abusers

    Let me have agreement with Josh. I understand backing away though I think it makes as many problems as it solve without more information.

    Let me challenge all of us. There is a story here. It matters and Naghmeh is on the hook for it. She has at some point not been forthcoming. Why are we being told so little and being told in such careful manner. We have supported Saeed. Should we have? She claims to be continuing to support Saeed. Is she?

    Truth is missing on some level.

  33. Michael says:

    I believe there are multiple stories and many missing facts.

    We did what we should have done with the facts we were given.

    The full stories will be hard to find…

  34. Steve Wright says:

    I have not shared either of the two emails, but will share this one paragraph as I think Naghmeh would not mind.
    —————————————
    I wanted to be real and ask you to pray for real things (I have opened myself up to you), but without judgment and without losing your love for your brother Saeed who is fighting for his life in the dark prison. This is what the Lord has been showing me, to love unconditionally the way He loves us. To see the sin, but love the sinner and to intercede for freedom from the sin. And not to give up. Not to ever give up on your loved one. To persevere and to endure.

  35. Soldier of Jah says:

    “Michael,

    My point is that scripturally there is no reason to accept the accusation though it may be true. There is certainly no reason for believers to violate scripture and violate our own jurisprudence to judge a man guilty and condemn him without hearing the matter.

    Your points are true as they stand. Josh’s stance is untenable on this one but he gets to live his conscience. We may have been taken down a rathole.’

    this is the same logic the elders at he Kingdom Halls use when one of their own gets accused of child abuse (sexual). It’s the tactics of cults protecting their own in leadership as the laity gets different more harsh judgment. I get he feeling if this guy didn’t have the TITLE of “Pastor” people would be throwing him under bus real quick. I choose to believe the wife who seems very credible. I think any talk of her lying for purposes of really protecting him are conspiracy theory.

  36. Nonnie says:

    Like everyone, I am confused and grieved over the last 2 emails about Saeed. However, I believe that if I can pray for my enemy, I can pray for an American citizen who is suffering in an Iranian prison. His wife has asked us to continue to pray. I will honour her request and will continue to pray for her and the children also.

    I confess, I have struggled with some of the same thoughts as Josh, but I will continue to pray.

  37. Soldier of Jah says:

    If her testimony is true then maybe we have to look at this form the perspective of praying for an unbeliever to be freed from an Iranian prison. Bearing fruits worthy of repentance doesn’t fit a supposed Pastor abusing his wife. When we become born again we are new creations in Christ and not that old man anymore. This isn’t just a case of maybe a husband having an occasional harsh word toward his wife, if her testimony is true which I believe it to be then it is a pattern of abuse which contradicts him even being a true Christian.

  38. Babylon's Dread says:

    Soldier

    So you condemn every accused person? Just so you know in the deuteronomic code the requirement for condemnation is two witnesses.

    I read your posts and see you advocating his condemnation. I will leave you to your ministry of death.

    I will leave you to your ministry of condemnation.

    He may be an abuser… then let her divorce him … no court would punish him further if he were released now… Nor would she based upon her own words.

    I pray I never fall into the hands of accusers and depend upon your soldiering for help.

  39. Josh the Baptist says:

    BD,
    The problem is that spousal abuse only has one witness. It happens behind closed doors. The couple generally can put a happy face on in public, but then it’s Hell in private. The quote that Steve shared earlier has been shared publically by Nagmeh on facebook, so I have no issue with talking about it. Here is just one of the hundreds of comments that she posted in that thread:

    ” I am not sure what the future holds. I just know I have to pray on my knees. At the same time, when Saeed comes back, I am not going to break the boundries that I have set for my protection. If Saeed is changed, it will have to be seen by me and my pastor and others before any steps are taken or boundaries are changed. Thank you for your message and concern.”

    At the very least, this has been shared with the pastor, and he isn’t coming forward to refute the claim. I’m telling you, I’m sure that I am wrong in some way, but I feel that I’ve been sold a false story for three years.

    Tell me which is more appealing: “Help us get this innocent missionary out of jail”, or “Help us get this SOB wife-beater back to the wife he abused”.

    I would love to have your pure heart on this, but that is just a HUGE stumbling block for me.

    Now, if I’m being honest, I doubt 100 other things about his story. I was lied to about this, why not everything else? He has become a tough case for me.

  40. Three Angels' Message says:

    It seems to me that spousal/child abuse happens more frequently in denominations that promote a more harsh form of family government such as spare thenrod spoil the child type of physical discipline or the man being in authority over the wife instead of being a servant leader to her.

  41. Babylon's Dread says:

    Three Angels.

    Even Naghmeh is telling us the abuse is a vestige of his cultural heritage not his christian faith.

    Josh,

    Thank you for your response.

    Still a man is in prison for the ministry of Jesus not for marital accusations. Unless that too was lies.

  42. j2theperson says:

    BD, it seems like your position would throw abused women under the bus. What help or recourse would be available to them if they can’t even get anyone to believe their claims because they have no one else to testify?

    Also, statistically speaking, only 2-8% of spousal abuse claims are false. http://www.ndaa.org/pdf/the_voice_vol_3_no_1_2009.pdf

  43. Babylon's Dread says:

    J2theperson

    My life would tell you exactly differently. I advocate and defend women. I tell them to leave abusive husbands and lovers who I confront with vigor. My stance is specific and clear and has to do with our position of this accusation against this man.

    Naghmeh Abedini is hardly at risk at this point but, the abandonment of Saeed in this context is unjustified, unnecessary and ungodly.

    Women have no trouble getting me to believe them. They have no trouble getting me to intervene. They would have trouble getting me to condemn those who are unconnected and uncharged.

  44. j2theperson says:

    Personally, these claims that Saeed abused and continues to abuse his wife make me question the events leading to his arrest. In 2009 he was detained and threatened but then ultimately released after he agreed to no longer involve himself in the Iran house ministries he’d been involved in. He could have easily stayed in America and never returned to Iran again. That would have been the prudent and intelligent thing to do. But people who abuse their spouses are selfish and arrogant and don’t think rules apply to them. For all I know that same selfish, arrogant hubris is what drove him to return to Iran even after he got away free.

    I don’t think it’s right that an American citizen is rotting in a foreign prison on bizarre, unenlightened foreign charges, but, given what Saeed is being revealed to be, it also doesn’t give me that sick feeling in my stomach that his imprisonment previously did.

  45. j2theperson says:

    Plus, God forbid Saeed simply not be verbally abusive to the one person who has done more to bring attention to his plight and possibly get him out of prison–if not even because he loves his wife but simply because it’s in his own personal best interest. That he apparently can’t do that speaks volumes about him.

  46. j2theperson says:

    BD, I am aware of what you have done personally in response to abuse; however not everyone may be, and your position on this matter is not clear. You plainly, baldly said

    ***So you condemn every accused person? Just so you know in the deuteronomic code the requirement for condemnation is two witnesses.***

    It’s hard to take that statement as pro-abused spouse.

  47. Papias says:

    Saeed is a brother in the Lord, rotting away in an Iranian prison, ostensibly for his faith.

    Saeed is also a sinner. Like us.

    We don’t pray for Saeed because of his character, but because we are told to in the Scripture.

    When he gets free and comes home, we deal with whatever issues exist.

  48. Steve Wright says:

    The only person our church has excommunicated in my tenure as pastor is an abusive husband. We did so, I am convinced, in a way that leaves no doubt to his guilt of his actions. It is possible to do such a thing.

    I’m not sure I agree that there is only one witness to spousal abuse, even though yes it happens behind closed doors and yes, the abuser might put on quite an act of goodness in public…but there are usually others who know what is going on.

    And the guy we booted is still online praising the Lord among the ignorant ones of his behavior.

    But he isn’t doing it at our church. And he isn’t hurting his wife anymore either…

    I’m guessing Dread, from all I know about him, has similar experience and does not coddle wife abusers in the slightest – but does so in a way that confirms the truth, not assumes it

  49. Michael says:

    I thought about all this most of the night.
    There’s too many conflicting narratives and details that have been offered, especially recently.
    There’s too much noise in the background I can’t make any sense of.
    There’s no one involved that I know and trust to bring clarity.
    To be honest, I’m doubting the whole scenario now.

    I don’t imagine that it matters much what I do or don’t think, but I’m going to take a step back.

  50. Michael says:

    Frankly, this story didn’t start going down in flames just because of the spousal abuse charges.
    We were led to believe for some time that the only communication with Saeed was through letters or visits his parents made to the prison.
    Now we are told of conversations via Skype and the mysterious presence of pornography in an Iranian prison.
    Huh?
    Then there was the claim that the allegations weren’t true, that she was just protecting her kids from some threat we knew nothing about.
    Then she doubles down on the matter.

    I’m feeling misinformed at best and played at worst.

  51. Three Angels' Message says:

    BD,

    I commend you for the wise counsel you give abused spouses. I would take it a step further and tell them to divorce those evil men or women and not look back. Too many times I have heard Pastor’s encourage abused wives not to divorce their abusive husbands. As long as a woman legally stays bound to an abusive huaband she is at risk.

  52. Papias says:

    Michael… that’s why I went back to the basics in #48…. too much other stuff to cloud the key issue at heart… a brother languishing in prison.

    [Heb 13:3 ESV] “Remember those who are in prison, as though in prison with them, and those who are mistreated, since you also are in the body.”

  53. Jean says:

    #52,

    “I commend you for the wise counsel you give abused spouses. I would take it a step further and tell them to divorce those evil men or women and not look back.”

    Unless a pastor is trained and qualified in marriage counseling, I would suggest that in may cases the spouse or spouses take the matter to a professional counselor who can provide an assessment of the viability of the marriage.

  54. Michael says:

    Papias,

    That may or may not be the key issue.
    I will certainly not try to influence anyone to cease whatever their conscience deems proper in this matter.
    I’m simply withdrawing myself and my media from the fray.

  55. Three Angels' Message says:

    I really do think the type of God denominations preach carries over to how the sheep treat others. For example, some denominations preach a frightening God and a God that is a tyrant so naturally they reproduce believers that also have this view which then affects their relationships with others. In Christianity, we serve a loving and kind God Yahweh and a gentle mild in spirit Divine Son, Jesus Christ of Nazareth. The character of God is one of love that derises not one single person to perish. God sent His only begotten Son as a ransom sacrifice because He loved the world (every single person). Christians should always present a God of mercy and love and yes justice and judgment but never a tryant who tortures people.

  56. Em says:

    1-abuse is wrong
    2-from what we see of the Middle East, from a very young age a man isn’t a man if he can’t subjugate his wife, i.e., keep her in her place by any and all means and that extends to all of womanhood …
    3- the brain is programmed on a subliminal level from a very young age
    4- the Abedini family are from the Middle East
    so it isn’t unreasonable to suspect that Saeed has a very serious besetting sin that in his culture wasn’t even a sin
    5- abuse is still wrong – culturally in the West and in God’s eyes a serious sin
    6- pray that Naghmah will be strong and overcome the pattern that abused wives tend to follow
    7- all we can do is pray for a good outcome … even a murderer can find forgiveness, if not restoration to society

  57. j2theperson says:

    Re: your 49, Steve. Yes, I understand that BD does not coddle abusers, but also making a statement like “Just so you know in the deuteronomic code the requirement for condemnation is two witnesses,” is not helpful. If people really took that seriously, it would result in the ignoring and perpetuation of abuse by the church and the constant re-victimizing of abuse victims.

    I never got into advocating for Saeed because, for whatever reason, doing so made me feel uncomfortable. I’m really glad now that I didn’t because the whole thing is turning into a fustercluck. I’d much rather spend my time posting about stuff like the Tsimhoni children in Michigan who are being abused by our *own* justice system–instead of stuff that’s happening in some godforsake 3rd world country where we already know everything sucks and we can’t really do anything to fix stuff anyways.

  58. Steve Wright says:

    I don’t want to get into the minutia of the Mosaic Law nor imply it is prescriptive for our governance as either a nation or a Church….but the text is pretty clear that the two witness thing has to do with the sentencing (of death) and is NOT the standard to make a diligent inquiry of any claim made by a single individual.

    God was not impractical or setting up a system that could ignore and perpetuate sin of any sort – even behind closed doors..

    The Law is holy, just and good.

    “And it be told thee, and thou hast heard of it, and inquired diligently, and, behold, it be true, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought in Israel:….”

    Too often the only standard today is the “it be told thee and thou has heard of it” and everyone stops there to make up their minds (either way)

  59. Three Angels' Message says:

    Too many times abuse in the church gets ignored. It brings a reproach upon our Lord Jesus Christ.

  60. Steve Wright says:

    j2 – sent you a question by facebook message. Thanks

  61. I don’t care what the guy does. I want all American released from Iraq – and I don’t know the background of any.

  62. Steve Wright says:

    A final word – I’ve seen and continue to see how one person can paint quite a picture when that person is the only one with the microphone. Can pull on a lot of heart strings and influence a lot of people.

    That picture looks entirely different when another brings additional facts into the light. Happened yet again to me, just last night. And even sharing just part of a counter (and not all that could be said) the influenced bystander totally changed his view, somewhat in shock, because the truth was so different than the picture painted at first that had such a strong emotional pull.

    Not to say that is happening here with the Abedini’s. But until one can hear from the other side, the Bible commands us to not make judgments. And we can’t hear the other side while the other side is in an Iranian prison.

    That being said, the flip side is true and there is no Christian obligation to actively support someone with a serious charge against them who is unable to present the other side either…. Let each be persuaded by their own conviction on activism but the Scripture does not allow freedom for making judgments without full knowledge.

  63. Ellen G. White Disciple says:

    At the end of the day MLD I agree, let’s get the guy home and hopefully the domestic issues get addressed.

  64. Josh the Baptist says:

    “I don’t care what the guy does. I want all American released from Iraq – and I don’t know the background of any.”

    I can agree with that, except it’s Iran. He is just one of many political prisoners there.

  65. j2theperson says:

    Steve, re: your 59, I agree but I also think that a statement such as “Just so you know in the deuteronomic code the requirement for condemnation is two witnesses,” will pretty much always be taken out of the context you outlined and will end up being used to protect abusers.

  66. j2theperson says:

    And, like MLD, I too would like all Americans in Iran released, but I would like it because Saeed is an American–not because he’s a christian.

  67. Cookie says:

    I’m unclear why this is even a discussion. A woman has forgiven her husband of his sin and tells us she loves him unconditionally and is on her knees forr him and wants us on our kness too. Yet we are to continue to condemn this man? When God forgives us and loves us unconditionally, do we still have a right to condemn ourselves? Uh. NOOOO!

    Stop judging. Stop condemning. Forgive and pray. Support this woman. Stop the cynicism and mistrust. Its disgusting.

  68. Josh the Baptist says:

    The wife says it is an ongoing problem. Not something in the past.

    Hard for me to rally behind an abuser when there are so many others suffering that need our help, too.

  69. Nonnie says:

    Question.

    Are there some who believe that she is being coerced into saying these horrible things about her husband, in order to save her children’s lives, etc??

    Or did I completely misunderstand that theory? (it seemed reasonable),
    but this second email seems to discount that theory. Just wondering.

  70. Josh the Baptist says:

    Yes, Nonnie. Originally that was my theory. Her facebook and follow-up comments this week discounts that possibility.

  71. Cookie says:

    Josh- you are welcome to your own opinion. You are abandoning a fellow sinner and some here are even questioning his salvation. The only person that matters to me is the man’s wife who has forgiven him and loves him more than ever before. I forgave my husband of years of abuse, drug addiction, pornography, etc. He still “struggles” with pornography- I still pray for him and stand beside him. I will not abandon him and he has acknowledged his sin and is repentant. That appears to be the same scenario with Sayeed.

  72. Josh the Baptist says:

    “That appears to be the same scenario with Sayeed.”

    That is not what his wife is saying.

  73. Cookie says:

    Huh?

    “I still love my husband more than ever and my advocacy for him has taken a new form of interceding on my knees…I can not deny the amazing dad he has been to our kids and the spiritual truths he poured into their life until the moment he was arrested.I believe that God will use Saeed’s imprisonment to break Saeed of these chains and to refine him and use him as a vessel for the work that He has prepared for him….I wanted to be real and ask you to pray for real things (I have opened myself up to you), but without judgment and without losing your love for your brother Saeed who is fighting for his life in the dark prison. This is what the Lord has been showing me, to love unconditionally the way He loves us. To see the sin, but love the sinner and to intercede for freedom from the sin. And not to give up. Not to ever give up on your loved one. To persevere and to endure.’

    Sounds like a wife that stands by her husband- acknoweldges he still struggles with sin- but asse us (her Christian family) to stand by him too.

    You can do what you want. I will stand with my sister in Christ and not abandon her husband.

    Gosh- I hope you never find yourself caught up in sin and seeking forgiveness.

  74. Babylon's Dread says:

    What a mess

  75. Josh the Baptist says:

    Cookie, your guilt trip won’t work with me. Saeed can be, and maybe has been forgiven. That has never been what this is about. This is about will I stand for an abuser.

    You said:
    ” I will not abandon him and he has acknowledged his sin and is repentant. That appears to be the same scenario with Sayeed.”

    Nagmeh said:
    ” At the same time, when Saeed comes back, I am not going to break the boundries that I have set for my protection. If Saeed is changed, it will have to be seen by me and my pastor and others before any steps are taken or boundaries are changed.”

    Does not appear that has has acknowledged and repented of his sin. Sure, he doesn’t hit her anymore, but then again, he’s been in jail for three years. Who knows what will happen if he is let out.

    As far as Nagmeh hoping for his release, there is this thing called battered-wife syndrome. It is terribly sad.

  76. j2theperson says:

    Quite honestly, it might be better for the kids if he stays imprisoned in Iran. If he gets released and comes back and they get divorced, he could get custody or partial custody and the kids would be stuck with an abusive parent and no protection.

  77. Babylon's Dread says:

    #77 is pretty offensive. There are multiple remedies for Naghmeh and the children especially with this being so public. To suggest this man stay longer in hell is partly rooted in a complete inability to imagine what his imprisonment is like. A Christian in an Iranian prison living under public accusations of abuse is vulnerable beyond our comprehension.

    Advocate for Naghmeh and the children with all your heart and voice but not this way.

  78. j2theperson says:

    I didn’t say he *should* stay in Iran. I said the kids might be better off. Our family courts are so messed up, kids get placed with abusers all the time. So, if there is some kind of faint silver lining to this it is at least the kids are probably safe. But that doesn’t mean it’s good that he’s in an Iranian prison or that he should stay there.

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