Jessa's Story

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  1. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    I was OK with everything in the video until… it said “to be continued.”

    I can accept everything they said if they would just walk away – I could say that they have repented, even perhaps been restored to fellowship – now just go away, sell aluminum siding up in Canada and come sit in the pews on Sunday.

    But you know what? I’ll bet that the “to be continued” is not that scenario.

  2. Bob Sweat says:

    MLD

    Its a commercial brake.

  3. Michael says:

    Bob,

    Exactly…

  4. Lutheran says:

    This makes me feel badly for those Pentecostals and charismatics who live with integrity.

  5. Psalm62 says:

    should anyone read this thread and think that this man’s faith is weak … may I submit that it is his body that is weak and that the men I known (in my long life) who have had serious heart conditions develop seem to run out of cope and feel dispair. And DMW has sufficient reason to feel despair from a human viewpoint. Strong men become child-like. They need all the support they can get. But I think it is systemic/physical, and does not involve failing faith.

    dunno, tho – just what I think I’ve seen… but I wouldn’t, for one minute question his walk with his God…

  6. Psalm62 says:

    ok – how’d I get my above post on this thread? it was meant for Pastor John’s (small screen sydrome?)

  7. Babylon's Dread says:

    This whole matter has become so sad…

    As one who is advocating for restoration with others … I shudder if restoring this man is the kind of equivalencies that people make.

    Someone challenged me yesterday about Todd and I simply reminded them that I did not think this man should have been in the ministry ANYWAY… he is quite simply a sad sad commentary on the absence of any standard for the office of the ministry.

    Ultimately I believed Todd was a slave of his ego… his self-aggrandizing piggery.
    Jessa has merely diverted the attention from the real problem. Todd needed to be trimmed of his incessant self-focus, self-serving, self-congratulatory presentations. Unfortunately even his restoration is feeding his addictions. He is a media whore. He wants to be the center of attention. He has already told us that his comeback will be the greatest ever… as he put it …the ‘latter house’ will exceed the “GLOry” of the former.

    Joyner by raising money, by preventing Todd from suffering consequences, by putting him in front of cameras and by covering many of the damning details …Rick has cloned the beast.

    I fear the end will be worse…

    I DREAD the appearance of Todd and Jessa’s doctrine of divorce that Joyner is promising.

    Ok I will shut up remembering that you all will blast me about Ted Haggard… and admitting that I find little similarity in the two.

  8. Drew says:

    I am sad as I watched this clip. Why am I sad? Makes me wonder if the great apostasy has come.

    Here are the basic facts:

    1. He saw and had an affair with another woman who was not his wife.
    2. She stole another woman’s husband.

    I can forgive them and have.

    Rick Joyner, if you read this it’s time to leave Todd and his wife off the TV for a very long time.

  9. Nomans says:

    Drew…
    “Makes me wonder if the great apostasy has come.”
    I had the same thought as I watched.

  10. Nomans says:

    italic fail :/

  11. Erunner says:

    I viewed the video and wasn’t too surprised. It did cause me to think about the Christian and divorce.

    A song that I enjoy is titled “The Lord Is Gracious And Compassionate.” Sadly there are too many divorces taking place within the Body of Christ. Many participants in these divorces then do one of the following. The philandering spouse goes on to marry God’s “new” man or woman for them. A non-philandering believer who up and divorces their spouse goes on to marry a non believer. This list could go on but I’ll stop as hopefully this will make sense.

    Time passes. We have a new couple who may be part of a local church. We may have a couple where just one is in church while the other is at home. They weren’t too interested in church to begin with so no surprise.

    Friends and family members must make a decision after the second marriage. As a family member you support the new couple and seek to love them as Jesus would. I imagine some would cut them out of their lives. I wouldn’t.

    More time passes and the details of said marriage fade into the background as you come to love the new addition to the family. You share Jesus with them. The new couple is now a loved part of the family.

    A “bystander” has observed one of the different possible scenarios. They see God’s grace being exhibited by all and the new marriage looks like a perfect example of God’s grace. I have no issue with that. What seems to be happening is we have marriages breaking up at alarming rates so that we look no different than the world. Some seem to view God’s grace as license and so they follow the example not feeling very convicted about the whole thing. The sanctity of marriage becomes the ultimate victim.

    The topic of divorce and remarriage can typically end up badly as strong views are expressed. I’m not seeking to enter that discussion. I’m seeking to make an observation of what I have observed through the years. I just hope it makes sense.

  12. centorian says:

    I wish she could have seen the wrong before they crossed the bride of marraige. A sign of end time apostasy?? Maybe… It is par for the course of those like Joyner and Bentley who operate from incorrect understanding of scriptures and essentially add to the word by their so called revelations and experiences.

    2Ti 4:3,4 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables.

    Todd and Jessa.. You want to serve Jesus? Go find a church and become the janitors there.

  13. Psalm62 says:

    I hear what BD is saying… and he is in a position to draw a distinction between the two, T.B and the Haggards. It is an important distinction.

    For Bentley, the overt sin is a manifestation of his true values or lack of them. Perhaps it goes deeper than, ‘does he fear God?’

    For Haggard, it isn’t his values that it are in question; it is a question of where does he go from where he went – now… How should he serve God? … have I got that right?

    Haggard would be restored to serve, but he has forfeited the role of Church leadership… is there any example that teaches otherwise?

    Both of these men manifest a flaw in the Body. We look for men with personality to inspire us to move forward in Christ. What has happened to us that we don’t hunger and thirst for Christ, Himself?

  14. centorian says:

    Haggard could be the gardener at the same church…..

  15. Babylon's Dread says:

    Centy,

    I understand your critique but no one that I know in the prophetic movement consider their declarations on a par with the scriptures…but we do need constant reminding lest the new believer get deceived.

    Ps62

    Your question is the pertinent one. Does forfeiting the role of Church leadership(Which Ted admits) preclude him from being restored to those qualities which would allow him to again lead.

    I will ask your question… “Is there any example that forbids him to be restored?” Our closest model in the scriptures is perhaps Peter but that his fall was prior to Pentecost muddies the water. Beside him, there was John Mark, who Paul seemed to disqualify and Barnabas seemed to restore. His offense was not sexual misconduct but we must begin to admit that many other matters apart from sexual misconduct can disqualify someone.

    I believe Ted can be re-qualified and thus restored. This is partly because he has as far as possible remedied all of his offenses. There are not as far as we know, victims who remain without any restitution. It has been three full years since his fall as of November. Anyway I am open to discussion.

    With Bentley, aside from the nature of his restoration, which has been a kind of a disneyland exile fully financed, there is the matter of a man who has seen his children but one time face to face in well over a year. No small matter. Further there is the matter of his ultimate refusal to forgive and restore his marriage while expecting to receive restoration.

    I do not think we can discuss this too much… we need to work at this in the body of Christ. And we need to get as many people restored as possible since we are in the forgiveness business. (yes that is a poor way to phrase it but you know what I mean)

    Even Bentley needs all the restoration that is possible… I just think he needs to get a job. That discipline alone would knock the edges off him.

  16. dansk says:

    “Both of these men manifest a flaw in the Body. We look for men with personality to inspire us to move forward in Christ.” Nice point! Is the Bride, like so many young women, drawn to flash and dash instead of Christlikeness?

    Bob Mumford said we need to be interested in the supernatural, not the spectacular.

  17. centorian says:

    dread,
    “Further there is the matter of his ultimate refusal to forgive and restore his marriage while expecting to receive restoration.”

    If I’m hearing you right, are you saying that Bentley went a bridge too far when he divorced and remarried?

    I would agree, even Bentley needs restoration. One of the toughest pills regrding this when I consider the defective platform by which he fell.

  18. Babylon's Dread says:

    A bridge too far when he divorced and remarried? Well not exactly but that gets at it.

    You see divorce is not the unforgivable sin but it is ultimately the sin of unforgiveness. Ultimately marriage fails when forgiveness fails to be a remedy for the conflict. So we have a request for forgiveness placed by one who did not forgive…

    I do believe remarriage is possible, even in the ministry, but this reality must be confronted…People get angry and say that “divorce is not the unpardonable sin.” When they say that to me I usually reply …”NO but it is the sin of refusing to pardon.”

    I want to be careful here because there are many contingencies …and many people have their spouse divorce them. In Bentley’s case he obviously was seeking the divorce. There were a thousand other possibilities open to him. But they would have required him to be patient and possibly celibate for a season.

    In this case TB apparently knew he was divorcing Shauna and nevertheless allowed the coronation service to go forward… THIS IS A BIG DEAL. It has bothered me … it was both Todd and Shauna that were commissioned that night. Thus I am suggesting that Todd not only adulterized his marriage he badly defrauded the church in a very public display that he could have refused….but as I say I believe recognition is his drug of choice.

  19. Babylon's Dread says:

    If I understand dansk he is right…

    WE mistake charisma for charism … We take personality as anointing. I believe we see much that is of the nature of Egyptian sorcerers and magicians in the pulpit and we think we have seen Moses.

    Big problem…

  20. Drew says:

    I believe the best way to handle this is to not debate continually the issues about Bentley and Ted. The issues are VERY clear. Of course someone does need to continue to stand up to the likes of Joyner and say, “the emperor has no clothes” and point out his error in fronting Todd.

    However, I believe the rest of should just refuse to participate in Joyner’s foolishness and peacefully say, “see ya.” But, not as an enemy but at a brother in the Lord.

    But of course I believe it has also been said in a secular sense, “fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me!” Wise words!

    Oh and for you me out there with a Jessica, learn the lesson now before you make the big leap. The fall may kill you!

  21. Drew says:

    OOPS! Jessa, not Jessica. Sorry.

  22. centorian says:

    drug of choice………

    no doubt each case needs to be supported by it’s own weight… I am concerned over what appears like a blatant disregard of God’s grace that was demonstrated by a sense of entitlement. Everyone wants to fulfill their own lusts. The godly person has learned to mortify the deeds of the flesh, deny themselves, take up their cross, and follow Jesus. More often than not, that path is not so appealing, but it does end in life.

  23. Psalm62 says:

    Centorian, “More often than not, that path is not so appealing, but it does end in life.” and what a life!!!

    I hate to go “pie in the sky, bye and bye” here – but, I believe that every denial of self indulgence (not to be confused with asceticism, which may be just twisted self indulgence) is going to be compensated many times over in Eternity. Bentley and his new thrill may make it into the kingdom (dunno), but the Lord will look at them and say, “sorry, guys, but you made your choice down there and they’re going to look at each other and say, “oh cr*p.”
    I don’t know what our promised joys are going to be then, but they’ll beat anything and everything down here…
    IMHO 😆

  24. Nomans says:

    I am about to speculate, so forgive me. I think the thing that bothers me the most here is it seems like they are calculating what repentance needs to look like to the people in order to get TB back into public ministry…
    I wonder how the Lord feels about agenda driven confessions.
    Even having it taped like this, and fed to the public.
    Again, I can’t see into the hearts here, but it just “feels” wrong.

  25. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    The biggest favor that Rick Joyner did for the body of Christ was to shut down his church for the whole month of August. He became neutral, no harm no foul – which equals good.

    I love it when a pastor thinks so highly of himself that when he goes, he closes down – “no one will stand in my pulpit.”

  26. dusty says:

    two min. into the video and all I can say is puke!

  27. dusty says:

    🙁 sorry

  28. james tiberius kirk says:

    Guys,
    We need to feel for Jessa…


    …and the pain she’s gone through…


    …when some horrible person…


    …OTHER than Todd Bentley…


    …committed an unspeakable act by…


    …piercing her face like that.

    I don’t feel well. Can I have that 2 minutes of my life back spent on the video?

  29. james tiberius kirk says:

    Honestly, all day long I deal with single college students, on the verge of marriage (and a few that are recently married)
    and we talk about purity and how their unblemished behavior will affect the rest of their life, their future marriage, kids….how indulging the flesh will yield corruption, mistrust and ultimately destruction in a marriage relationship down the road…how trust is hard-won and easily lost.

    My wife doesn’t worry AT ALL about me being faithful, even when she’s at home pregnant and the young concubines on campus are wearing less and less because she knows I controlled myself with her.

    Their marriage must be its own punishment and hell-on-earth; Jessa’s insecurity must be (rightly) INSANE…

  30. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    I think this guy is a Joyner / Bentley product. I would say that I hate teasing these guys – but actually I love it.

  31. dansk says:

    RJ has been closing his church every August for many years. He tells the people, Go visit other churches, and if you find one you like better, stay there.

    It has nothing to do with not wanting to give up his pulpit. It has to do with hating ministerial manipulation and self-promotion and making sure noone is sticking around for the wrong reasons.

    MLD, you are usually pretty well-informed, but your 7:50 gives the impression you did not understand that.

    The group here can sweetly and insularly self-affirming, but when it launches into passing judgement, it shows its ugly side.

  32. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    dansk,
    Thanks for the comment – I like mine better. 🙂

  33. brian says:

    I know this is stupid and I could kick myself for it, but imagine if a move of God leads to his repentance, just imagine. I do hope I really do. Mostly I hope for his first wife and their kids, she strikes me as a class act.

  34. Psalm62 says:

    someone like dansk always cycles back to “love the sinner,” don’t judge him… that’s good, but we need one of those disclaimer things = “we love sinners – we hate whitewash?” dunno 🙄

    God keep all of us close tonight

  35. Babylon's Dread says:

    Actually… I think RJ closes in July… it is the 7th month….

  36. Babylon's Dread says:

    J T K …

    That is AWESOME!… and the insight is right on… whenever I find a controlling spouse I look for a root of immorality…

  37. jlo says:

    BD, I respect the way you have handled the TB situation. You have shown yourself to be a man of the Lord.

  38. centorian says:

    psalm 62…… great comments, thanks

    dread and jtk,
    to quote dread:

    “whenever I find a controlling spouse I look for a root of immorality…”

    true. I have found that to be the case over and over. Some way, some place, some how, immorality is below the surface. Sex isn’t always about love or passion.

  39. brian says:

    MLD I remember being in the “presence” of such anointed folks. They always saw me as a satanically inspired piece of trash. I do not deny that assertion in the least. But after so many times of being pushed on the forehead and the strange look I got when I did not fall down like a tree and flopping around like some fish out of water. I wanted to have that experience, which is also a sin on my part, a Christian should not wish to have an experience of God that transcends the intellect or the apologetic. I never did understand that, but it is the way things are. I feel for this man, another emotional trait I should repent of, but he really wants it to be true as did the many I was involved in. Most of them are avid atheists now, a small price to pay, but I always found that sad.

    Personally I dont get it, I never have.

  40. James Downing says:

    Bentley has been a fraud from day one. Adultery was the least of his problems. Notice that noone now talks about his fake healings, fake raising the dead, horrible theology, fasle prophecy…only about Jessa.

    Jessa was a convenient smokescreen. Of course if adultery was his only sin, he could be restored. As is, he is being restored to the office of false prophet.

  41. dansk says:

    July, yes.

    Jesus was the one who said, Don’t judge. If you have a problem with that, take it up with Him.

    If He did not mean, Don’t judge, what did He mean?

    I don’t judge you for being judgemental. I do not go to other sites and slander you.

    But I do come here and – because I love you so much – challenge you to your faces concerning your behavior.

  42. Michael says:

    This is what Jesus said;
    ““Judge not, that you be not judged.
    For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you.”
    (Matthew 7:1–2 ESV)

    I fully respect Dreads willingness to judge his own actions by the measure he uses with others.

    Here’s what Paul said;


    For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge?”
    (1 Corinthians 4:3; 5:12 ESV)

    What did he mean?

  43. Psalm62 says:

    Is it possible that we hang up on the word (judge) – adjudication is God’s business, but how can the Body function without some discernment and house-cleaning? …

  44. Psalm62 says:

    Hey, Michael forgot to say ‘you’d better not be doing anything heavier than typing!’ Don’t make me come down there 😆

    praying

  45. Michael says:

    Psalm62,

    Trust me….I’m not doing much! 🙂

  46. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    dansk,
    “If He did not mean, Don’t judge, what did He mean?”

    Well, he meant for me to be sure I had the plank out of my eye first. Right after that statement Jesus said “do not give the dogs what is sacred”, and “do not throw your pearls to the pigs.”

    Don’t I need to first be able to judge who are the ‘dogs’ and who are the ‘pigs’? So I have done so in obedience to the scriptures – why do you take issue with me?

    Shortly thereafter, Jesus said “watch out for false prophets.” Why do you Dansk, judge me for following that scripture?

    Come on, be real – these guys have earned a good mocking! 🙂

  47. Drew says:

    dansk:

    “If He did not mean, Don’t judge, what did He mean?”

    I’ll start with this:

    “Understanding this saying of Jesus in the light of rabbinic teachings on judging yields both insight and wise application for life. Apparently, Jesus’ saying is related to a well-known rabbinic dictum: “Judge every person in favorable terms” (Mishnah, Avot 1:6). The rabbinic statement is an interpretation of Leviticus 19:15, “You shall do no injustice in judgment; you shall not be partial to the poor nor defer to the great, but you are to judge your neighbor fairly.” According to Israel’s ancient sages, if one wants to be entirely fair in judging one’s neighbors, one should give them the benefit of the doubt, that is, “judge them favorably.”

    One of Jesus’ sayings regarding judging is nearly identical to other rabbinic sayings on the subject: “For in the way you judge, you will be judged; and by your standard of measure, it will be measured to you” (Mt. 7:2; Lk. 6:38). In the Talmud it is stated, “He who judges his neighbor favorably will be judged favorably by God” (Babylonian Talmud, Shabbat 127a). …”

    Lois Tverberg, PHD, director of the En-Gedi Resource Center in Holland, Michigan, a U.S. representative of Jerusalem Perspective.

    So how can we judge Todd and the others like him?

    The question is what kind of judgment are we talking about?
    Todd and others have demonstrated both actions and behavior which are:

    1. – unbiblical
    2. – false teaching

    The judgment then is not about salvation but about should they teach, directly or indirectly (through influence) in the community of Christ followers. Additionally the standard is not how you or I live, want to live or act but on what is clearly determined through scripture and creation (both of which Jesus also confirmed).

    So what are we to do in my opinion:

    1. – Forgive them.
    2. – Not allow the furtherance of their behavior (open immorality and false teaching) in the community of Christ followers.

    Should Todd and others like him decide either of these are not enough they are free to go and live and do in any way they so choose.

    The problem with this is we humans tend to become very legalistic and exceed our bounds and start to CONTROL how people live down to the smallest details. The very size of the “oral traditions/law” which Jesus spoke to when he talked about their “yoke” is a very good example of this.

    A good example of this nit picking is the tattoos and pins Todd and Jessa wear. Personally I don’t like them and do not find most of them attractive, but will someone please tell me where God prohibited them in either creation or the Law and how would they affect ones salvation?

    Oh well, dansk again I forgive them, they would be welcome at church (based upon their apparent change) but as far as ministry I have a problem there. Kind of like letting a convicted child molester teach my children, just not going to happen.

    Too long!

    Drew

  48. Babylon's Dread says:

    James Downing

    I have repeatedly stated that TB was fallen before Jessa and that all his issue with her did was to obscure the real problems….

    Ego, untruthfulness, chicanery, and self-seeking all exceed Jessa… Jessa is a result of a man full of such things…

    Rick Joyner has yet to show that he has the will to deal with it.
    I also thing we have all had enough of the videos… what he claimed would be an open process is really nothing more than truth-shaping the same way the secular crowd does it.

  49. James Downing says:

    Bingo BD, You are all over it.

  50. Concerned says:

    This is disgusting..

    As if he was unaware of what they were doign at the tiem they were doing it.
    This is an unsult to anyone with any intelligence.
    The problem is that Christians are so gullible that they can forgive anything..even when it is as obvious as a deception as these 2.

    Even a heathen could see through this..
    How easy it is to repent after the fact.

    It reminds me of my old church bringing in all the young adults(for youth services) who left the church after being raised in the church, who had abortions, did drugs, had s*x outside of marriage,e tc….all they has to do was repent and God was fine… almost giving the kids the license to sin…It is just the approach.
    Next these 2 will be writing a book

  51. Babylon's Dread says:

    Yes Concerned

    A book is on the way…

  52. Concerned says:

    Dread,

    Really?

    If the book publishers had any discernment, they wouldn’t give these people an audience, and financial support.

  53. Concerned says:

    Actually Michael’s comment here is giving me a much needed laugh today.
    Kind of helps me see this as some kind of bizarre entertainment.

    “Todd…take your tart and get out of the ministry…you’re not David, she’s not Bathsheba and we’re not buying this act.”

  54. Babylon's Dread says:

    Publishers do not give a tinker’s damn about TB… it is about the cash

  55. Drew says:

    Someone censored this thread.

    Ugly stuff was said.

  56. Michael says:

    Lies were repeated that I have investigated and refuted.

    If the coward would like to contact me I’m easy to find.

  57. Dusty says:

    Drew is a poet 🙂

  58. Dusty says:

    Michael is right – it was all lies and does not need to be here…

  59. Ron says:

    What is never addresses in any of the videos, are the enumerated heresies, the fact that reprobates such as Bob Jones “prophesied” over Bentley that he had a double portion of the Branham Anointing…another bunch of neo-nut job Pentacsotal double speak…that biblaically is meaningless. William Branham, was soemone who called the doctrine of the TRrinity blasphemous, thought he was Elijah the pohet. Nice company. Bottom line for me,between, the blaphemies, heresies, false prophecies, sexual immorla bhaviour…that he is still engaged in with his new “wife”, the scam he ran at Fakeland, where Bentley told the minions…God is calling a thousand of you to give a thousand dollars….hmmm, benny Hinn-esque if you ask me …Bentley is transpearently a false prophet and a reprobate…Evereyobe of the areas I mentioned completely disqualifies him form even handing out a bulletin into the entrance of the sanctuary. Biblically…HE IS,a nd HAS BEEN set outside the fellowship, he is under God’s discipline…and eteranl judgement until he repents. Sadly, with the charlatans and hirelings he asscoaites with, that would be a miraculous event.

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