The Gospel for Asia Game Plan

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56 Responses

  1. Babylon's Dread says:

    The beat goes on

  2. Michael says:

    Just think about how much better we could be if we just dealt with things up front.

  3. Sinner and Saint says:

    Skip has an honorary doctorate from GFA’s Seminary? That’s fantastic. Just the fact that Skip sits on their board would be reason enough for me to stop supporting them.

  4. Michael says:

    S & S… I hear you.

    The last thing I want though is this to get twisted into just another PhxP against Heitzig story.

    This is about GFA and Heitzig is only mentioned because he is in a place of accountability and authority…or it would please me never to mention his name again.

    It makes me cough.

  5. Sinner and Saint says:

    Michael…yes, this is problem enough on its own.

    I do wonder however…is there any connection to Skip’s leadership (when did he join the board?) and their financial indiscretions?

  6. Michael says:

    S&S,

    That would be “alleged” financial indiscretions.
    He’s been on the board during the time frame in question.

  7. EricL says:

    If GFA implodes due to all these alleged shenanigans, I fear that KP will just retreat back to India and live a life of luxury and prestige as a self-appointed Metropolitan. It looks like he has squirreled away lots of the money that should have gone to the workers out in the field; I just hope GFA comes out and proves all these accusations wrong, but they show no desire to do so.

    The little guys will all get burned, both the Americans and the Indians, while KP can claim persecution and go on to cry in his mansion. Well, it was a great act that had a long run. Time for a new show. Maybe he can start a ministry where people sponsor a poor, deserving metropolitan named KP.

  8. conscientious objector says:

    Anyone else SICK and TIRED of all this???

  9. Kevin H says:

    I’ve obviously already written and commented much on this subject here. Without going about and repeating myself about every detail, I did personally speak to a higher level leader within GFA for over an hour. Even though I did not interrogate them hard in the conversation, I initially came away from the conversation feeling somewhat dissatisfied as I had a general sense of a lack of forthcomingness on some issues. As time went on, I came to learn that some of the answers they had given me conflicted with answers they had given to others on the same subjects. So they lied to either me or the others, or both.

  10. Kevin H says:

    When I had my conversation with the GFA leader, he asked about where I went to church and I told him CC Philly. Soon after learning this, he told me that the internal investigation and report on the GFA Diaspora group was done by a GFA board member who is also a board member of CC Albuquerque (Gayle Erwin). I guess he thought this would make me feel better because of the CC connection. Of course, it did nothing but send up another red flag because of my knowing the history of corruption at CC Albuquerque. After the conversation, I researched to see who else was on the GFA board and found good ‘ol Skip along with some close family members of K.P. Yohannan. There were only two board members who were not family or CC Albuquerque affiliated. More red flags. My trust in GFA has only continued to erode since then as more and more suspicious looking activity and information keeps getting uncovered with a severe lack of answers coming from GFA.

  11. A Friend says:

    Good reporting. Don’t give up.

    However, I personally see this all for what it is.

    It is further testimony that “Christianity” and the Transformation Gospel is largely a sham. That doesn’t mean God isn’t real or that the Gospel isn’t real…it’s just that I personally have as much faith in human beings being corrupt as I do in God being “the good”

    It is actually very freeing to really know that the vast majority of organized Christianity is just as human (and oft-times worse) than the rest of us schmucks.

    If these folks somehow don’t burn in hell forever, then I’m good to go LOL. Thanks! 🙂

  12. Disillusioned says:

    Any Calvary Chapel pastors who are aware of these very troubling financial and spiritual problems with GFA have a responsibility to TELL PEOPLE. GFA would not have gotten as huge as it is without explicit cooperation and advertising by CC pastors. They are liable to speak up to one another and to the people. They are culpapble. Man up, CC.

  13. A Friend says:

    “Any Calvary Chapel pastors who are aware of these very troubling financial and spiritual problems with GFA have a responsibility to TELL PEOPLE”

    They don’t care. They only care about their own Franchise and that they have a paycheck. That’s the sad truth for the vast majority of them…and the vast majority of Evangelicalism as well.

    It is what it is. The mythology I clinged to for years has been replaced by a sobering reality of how things really are. No biggie, it’s actually quite freeing and I give “pastors” no place in my life as any sort of power or authority. They are corrupt humans and no more “transformed” than anyone else.

    It’s actually a truer Gospel when you think about it.

  14. Kevin H says:

    “Any Calvary Chapel pastors who are aware of these very troubling financial and spiritual problems with GFA have a responsibility to TELL PEOPLE”

    – To keep things fair, we saw an example of this happening just Tuesday on the Linkathon thread. Now, it probably needs to happen much more (and maybe it is happening in some other cases we have not heard about). But we should be encouraged that we have seen at least this one concrete example.

  15. Judy says:

    I am amazed and I still haven’t yet recovered from the revelation that there really is no Christian leadership in this country among the well-known elite of pastors and the likes – no one willing to stand up and call evil, evil and good, good in situations like these. This all became evident in the MHC and MD mess.

    It seems that no one will take the risk or pay the cost of what they must imagine is “turning on their own” (and even that thought is so problematic that it makes my head spin). There is no big name out there bringing discernment about these false gospels and false leaders and the damage they have brought to the name of Christ. They all stick to their own tribe and keep their mouths shut.

    For that reason, I have stopped listening to all of them. I don’t care how great their teaching is, I don’t care how loved they may be. If they won’t protect or at least warn God’s people, I do not trust them anymore. I think the real men of God are the little guys running small churches without the spotlight, living it day by day without the big bucks and the empire to go with it.

    This empire building has been one of the worst things to happen to America Christianity. I can’t see anything else that has caused such corruption, lust, greed, and produced more children in the faith who have no clue who God really is.

  16. Judy may have touched on something. Why is “good teaching” so important. How about someone who is a good pastor, who can deliver at least a mediocre sermon (which believe it or not is 180 degrees opposite from a Bible study from the pulpit) and someone who is willing to put himself under the leadership of someone else?

    Everyone can complain about the elite – so join a denomination, they seem to level these guys out. For the over 9 yrs I have been here, everyone still complains about the same model but very few have moved away from it.

  17. Michael says:

    I have no information that says Gayle Erwin is on the board in Albuquerque.

    Gayle has never been featured on the PhxP…maybe it’s time he was.

  18. conscientious objector says:

    Maybe MLD is right! Just join a dead, boring, pew-sitting denomination and be content… but don’t all ecumenical roads lead to Rome???

  19. Kevin H says:

    Michael,

    As for Gayle Erwin being on the board of CC Albuquerque, I only pass on what I was told by the GFA leader in my phone conversation. It’s possible he could have been mistaken (or even lying). I have no manner to verify Erwin’s presence on the Albuquerque board.

  20. Michael says:

    Kevin H,

    The latest on the New Mexico Corporations website doesn’t list him.
    That doesn’t mean he’s not…they do infrequent updates.

  21. Em says:

    Judy’s post is food for thought for me today… especially the reference to Christian “elite” – my first reaction was we have the “elect,” but no elite… but then while thinking on the word, i googled the term and Wikipedia:
    “In political and sociological theory, an elite is a small group of people who control a disproportionate amount of wealth or political power.” and realized that the reality is, they’re out there among us Believers now
    we need men like Michael et al who can follow Nathan’s O.T. example and say essentially, “thou art [one of these] men”
    i pray that some of those who’ve been smiling inside and thinking to themselves, “yes, i am an elite, praise God – but i’m a humble servant of His nonetheless,” will be convicted and repent…
    the banks have the Donald – the Church needs more Michael’s IMHO

  22. Em says:

    no, the Church doesn’t need more Michael’s… we’ve just about stripped him down to his shorts already… sorry about that apostrophe, but we do need more LIKE Michael 🙂

  23. Michael says:

    Thanks, Em…I wish that what we did was unnecessary and I was unknown outside of my own community.
    There’s still time I suppose… 🙂

  24. Gayle Erwin’s been a breath of fresh air every time I’ve heard him.
    He’s solid.
    His site: http://www.servant.org/

    Enjoy the reviews of his book “Jesus Style”
    http://www.amazon.com/The-Jesus-Style-Gayle-Erwin/dp/1565992253

  25. Hang in there Michael. Hope you get inspired by Gayle’s take on things.

  26. Michael says:

    If he’s solid he’ll repent for what he’s doing to the GFA Diaspora.
    Working on that article now.

  27. Just a little reality check for you, Michael.
    I discovered Phoenix Preacher when ChuckJr pointed me to the community.
    You have enabled us who were part of the Calvary Chapel movement, who were terrified to question or speak for fear of being shunned and labeled troublemakers, who were simply told, “If you don’t like it, feel free to move on”, you have helped us become more secure in our relationship with God, to know that there are more of us, that we’re not alone, not crazy.

    Pause for 5min and reflect on how you’ve helped us.

    Thank you, Michael.

  28. Michael says:

    Thank you, G…I appreciate that much.

  29. conscientious objector says:

    Gayle Erwin Endorsed “THE SHACK”

    “The Shack is a one of a kind invitation to journey to the very heart of God. Through my tears and cheers, I have been indeed transformed by the tender mercy with which William Paul Young opened the veil that too often separated me from God and from myself. With every page, the complicated do’s and don’t that distort a relationship into a religion were washed away as I understood Father, Son, and Holy Ghost for the first time in my life.”

  30. Muff Potter says:

    MLD @ # 16:

    I was raised Lutheran in the Southeast corner of Wisconsin. And you’re right, Lutheranism (as a mainline) has always had a structure in place that puts the brakes on Moses model despots who might try to take over a church, and that’s a good thing. Where there’s no regulation, train wrecks will happen.
    I have an old Lutheran hymnal (Concordia 1941) and it’s liturgical content is based 100% on Scripture. If that’s not being ‘fed by the Word of God’ I don’t know what is. So yeah MLD, you’re right on this one, if folks still choose to remain under the auspices of a fundagelical despot, they deserve each other.

  31. Kevin H says:

    Michael,

    Are you meaning the “investigation” and report that Gayle issued to the GFA Diaspora that K.P. said would take only 10 days but somehow ended up taking over 6 months even though Gayle actually contacted next to nobody in the GFA Diaspora group during all that time? The report that says we’re sorry we hurt you, but we don’t think there is any basis to your claims and we will not meet with you to discuss these matters? Is there more to the story?

  32. conscientious objector says:

    The Luthern church in my area allows LGBT ordinations…

  33. conscientious objector says:

    Can the ECFA also be bought off mafia style?

  34. Muff Potter says:

    @ # 32,

    The LCMS (lutheran church missouri synod) allows no such thing. You must be referring to the ELCA wing of Lutheranism.

  35. Michael says:

    Kevin H,

    That’s the one…article in about five minutes.

  36. Xenia says:

    That’s “Dr.” Heitzig…who was given an honorary doctorate from…wait for it…Gospel For Asia Seminary in India.<<<<

    Alright, NOW I'm mad!

    As someone who hangs around on the fringes of academia and knows the great amount of effort that goes into earning a genuine post grad degree…. good grief.

  37. Jim Vander Spek says:

    GFA’s 2014 audit appears to be in process and their latest ECFA renewal is pending. No one forced GFA to either provide an audit or to be a part of ECFA. It is good that they are doing both. Otherwise, the many accusations and concerns swirling around them could either fester or be pushed aside. In fact, some may never have come to light. The clock is ticking. Calling ECFA complicit at this stage is not fair IMO.

  38. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    conscientious objector said,
    “Maybe MLD is right! Just join a dead, boring, pew-sitting denomination and be content…”

    Actually it depends on perspective
    1.) dead – yes, we are dead in our sin and we know it – we have come to church to do something about it. Unlike perhaps your congregation that has no sin issues week to week.
    2.) boring – perhaps, after all it is just God doing his work there – bringing absolution to a dead and confessing group of people can’t be too exciting – he doesn’t need the help of a garage band. I may ask why does your God need the help of a garage band?
    3.) pew sitting – other than Xenia’s church – where do you folks sit?
    4.) be content – after being at the Lord’s Table at the end of the service, yes we are very and I will repeat very content. Sorry to hear of the lack of contentment at your church. I guess when all you have to look forward to is a popular downloader of information and a garage band you would be discontent.

  39. Michael says:

    Jim,

    When an organization tells another organization to no longer answer questions about serious matters, that’s complicity.
    Period.

  40. conscientious objector says:

    LCMS-ELCA-ABC-123- it’s all Lutheran to me…

  41. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    conscientious objector

    I can take the Lutheran hit, but don’t give me trouble when I lump all you evangelicals together – Benny Hinn and Joel Osteen and TD Jakes all call themselves evangelicals along with all your favorite CC guys and whomever you hang out with this month.

    But you notice, we only talk about your guys – and you still hang with the same types…

  42. Jim Vander Spek says:

    “bloggers and reporters” = “organizations” ? This is all coming to light and all eyes are on GFA. Their failure to come up with answers by now is hurting them. ECFA is a positive force in all of this. How many organizations, including most independent churches, have no transparency or accountability whatsoever?

  43. Muff Potter says:

    @ # 40,

    Sounds like you also have trouble telling the difference between doo-doo and shinola and would have no qualms about polishing your boots with the former.

  44. Michael says:

    Jim,

    Whether you or ECFA like it or not, bloggers are now part of the media.
    A powerful part.
    There is no excuse for telling GFA to refuse to answer honest inquiry.
    That’s called a cover up.
    Positive force, my ass…just another hireling is more like it.

  45. conscientious objector says:

    But you notice, we only talk about your guys – and you still hang with the same types…

    Agreed MLD! We evangelicals are really screwed up as well… Sigh!

    But wait a minute, I was s/told that we were the “special” anointed ones who are much more spiritual than all of the other kids on the playground… fact!

  46. conscientious objector says:

    doo-doo and shinola… no need to polish with doo-doo, I think we are all knee deep in it already!

  47. Jim Vander Spek says:

    Bloggers have thankfully played the leading positive role in this. However, if GFA was not a part of ECFA they may have been able to keep stonewalling forever. Your parallel example with CCABQ—not an ECFA member—illustrates this. No one knows all that ECFA and GFA have been saying to each other and it is too early to cast judgment on that IMO.

  48. Michael says:

    That’s your opinion. I know what they have instructed GFA to do. The mainstream Christian media has been bought and sold already.

  49. Kevin H says:

    GFA told me that the ECFA advised them not to speak to Throckmorton. They didn’t mention other media outlets. Nor did they mention any other entity advising them not to speak, so it would seem the ECFA was the main one, if not only one, that GFA was giving weight to. I advised them that they should talk to Throckmorton, along with other media if they ask questions. Not hard to see who they have decided to listen to.

    While GFA being a member of the ECFA *may* be better than nothing, the ECFA is most seemingly playing a significant role in GFA choosing not to give answers to the public.

  50. conscientious objector says:

    The mainstream Christian media has been bought and sold already.

    Very true Michael, sadly! I feel you are hitting the bedrock, core issues that are causing the cancer within “Christianity Today” (pun Intended)…

    Thank you Michael!

  51. Michael says:

    Thanks, CO. I’d rather write about cats…

  52. conscientious objector says:

    Just a shout out reminder to keep Michael in prayer as he boldly stands up for truth…

    We know that the Light of Truth exposes the hidden things of darkness and sometimes the sparks will fly!

    Lord, please cover Michael under your protective Wings! Psalm 91

  53. Michael says:

    Thanks again, CO…prayers much appreciated.

  54. Mark says:

    There appears to be a giant misconception about ECFA. They are not a watchdog group. They do not act on behalf of donors or the public. Their Board is comprised of top people from giant nonprofits, who are interested in protecting themselves from further scrutiny. The ECFA Chairman is Michael Little, President of CBN (yes, CBN who makes billions by broadcasting prosperity preachers with ghostwritten books and fake degrees).

    You see, in the 70’s, many televangelists were caught with fraudulent financial dealings, and the public sentiment was to have Congress remove the tax-exempt status (which they feared would reduce donations) or make them subject to audits with real penalties like prison (which they feared would shine the light of truth on themselves).

    So the biggest nonprofits, those with the most to lose, decided to SELF REGULATE. They came up with the ECFA as the vehicle, and using political influence, got Congress (“the people”) to back off of the initiative to bring the IRS down on non-profits.

    So the ECFA has a lot of official statements about integrity and independence and Godly principled leadership yada yada yada. The thing is, their members don’t come close to living up to those standards, and ECFA does not enforce those standards. It is mostly just theater. A stage act.

    With rare exceptions, the only way that ECFA will remove a member is if they fail to provide the 3 magic things: A form, a financial, and a fee. They just have to “say” they have integrity, an indepedent board, and proper controls. ECFA doesn’t have any idea. You’re all being set up to believe something that isn’t so.

    The way it works is, a nonprofit has a financial audit done. This is really not that big of a deal. It costs about $15K. The thing is, a nonprofit only has a 5-line P/L statement. It only tells you Revenue, plus 3 Expense items: Admin, Fundraising, and “Program Expenses”, plus net income/loss. That’s it. So what we have is the illusion of financial integrity.

    Joyce Meyer is a word of faith shyster. Yet she files a financial statement with ECFA. They report that Joyce took in $114 million, spent $113 million. How was the $113 million spent? Who knows? All the auditors do is see that the expenditures were expenditures. This tells the donors nothing. But Joyce Meyer can claim she is a proud member of ECFA. When Joyce Meyer got investigated by Congress for luxury living, ECFA came to her defense, and helped her argue that Congress should not be investigating Creflo Dollar, Eddie Bishop, Kenneth Copeland, etc.

    Steven Furtick’s Elevation Church joined ECFA in 2014. If you recall, Furtick built a $3 million mansion recently. There is no way to discern Furtick’s compensation from the Elevation church financials shown on ECFA’s website. ECFA features Furtick in their promotions with a smarmy self-serving quote about how wonderful everyone is. Phooey!

    Never believe that ECFA will help you, the donor, before or after the fact. They will always protect their own. They are not shepherds. They enable wolves to prey on the sheep while keeping Congress off everyone’s back. Any investigation they launch has its conclusion written before it starts.

  55. Mr Jesperson says:

    FYI Michael, thought you should know a bit more about Mr Vander Spek. The first comment he left here is basically identical to one he left on Warren’s blog. He is very CC connected. You can see his bio here: http://www.overcoming-lust.com/bio/ The pictures are the same at that site and on his posts on Warren’s blog. He is a board member for a ministry located about 1 mile east of Skip’s megachurch. Anything else you might want to know can be found in the comments here: http://www.patheos.com/blogs/warrenthrockmorton/2015/08/04/gospel-for-asia-and-evangelical-council-for-financial-accountabilitys-standard-4/
    I have helped with a ECFA audit. I was not impressed. My opinion is that they are a joke. They sell a brand of false transparency. They do not walk in the light. I do not believe that they are Christians because they do not fear the judgment seat of Christ where all of us are headed. I believe the same about the GFA leadership.

  56. openeyes says:

    Here is the Persecution Watch Annual report for 2014 (India)
    http://www.efionline.org/the-news/persecution/628-efi-persecution-watch-annual-report-2014

    Persecution Watch, Sept. 13, 2015 (India)
    http://www.efionline.org/the-news/persecution/639-persecution-watch-sept-13-2015

    You can monitor the persecution in India for yourself to see how high it is. I don’t recall violent acts against Americans nor specifically Christian Americans. Interesting that GFA won’t allow Americans to come to India now.

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