Things I Think

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40 Responses

  1. Dan from Georgia says:

    Wife and I will pray for your beloved Miss Kitty! From one grateful pet daddy to another!

  2. Michael says:

    Dan, thank you.

    I’m about as upset as I get…companions from any species are hard to come by.

  3. Judy says:

    Thank you for #4. I lived on the East Coast during the Jesus Movement and was saved, not as a result of anything Chuck or Lonnie did, but because God was having a revival and it was touching the East Coast as well as the West Coast and HE was saving souls as HE saw fit. I really churn when I hear that Chuck Smith started the Jesus Movement. There is a pastor who was on the East Coast who claimed the same thing – thinking that he was the start of the Jesus Movement.

    You are right. God does not share or give away His glory, but CC tries, regularly, to do that when they bring up this matter and insist that it was all about Chuck.

  4. Michael says:

    Judy,

    That revival was a sovereign act of God and He used thousands of people.
    Nobody can claim it for their group or their heroes.
    I just hope He chooses to do it again…

  5. Judy says:

    Regarding #1: I think that these guys think that they are above everyone else. It’s fine for the people in the pews to cry and tear out their hair over their sins, but the leaders have to keep up the front of being perfect until they are absolutely proven to have sinned or done something aggregious. And even then, they seem unable to bear being seen as less than anything perfect.

    People are leaving the church in droves. Five years ago, you wouldn’t hear Christians talking so freely about institutional, corporate Christianity. And those who did were considered church hoppers, wolves, and troublemakers. How dare anyone criticize leaders! But now, I see that plenty of older and also younger Christians are finding these churches to be empty temples and they want nothing to do with it.

    That’s not to say there aren’t plenty of good, solid churches around, but a lot of times they seem to be the smaller, older ones who haven’t caved to church growth and the likes.

  6. Michael says:

    Judy,

    Your #5 is truth.
    The problem that no one wants to deal with is that if leaders are not open about confessing and repenting of sin, then their congregation will follow the leaders.

    Thus, we have a church that no longer is a conduit of grace…because there must be an offense to forgive for grace to manifest.

  7. OCDan says:

    Michael and Judy, a hearty Amen to #4. Michael, I know this about GFA and CC, but there are many a church, mega and small, that try to steal God’s glory, when it is all His. Not making excuses, just pointing out how much more prevalent and in the open it has become in this day and age.

  8. Michael says:

    OCDan,

    Agreed.

    What we’re seeing here is just a microcosm of the celebrity corporate church today.

  9. Jeff Sheckstein says:

    Judy (5) and Michael (6)

    As Chuck would say, “as is the shephard, so are the sheep.”

    Michael. I pray your kitty makes a full recovery. Just got a puppy Malshi after I had to put down my beloved Bichon of 15 years.

  10. Michael says:

    Thank you, Jeff.
    In our little church we lost two long time companions of our families last week…and we cried a lot yesterday.
    My heart is with you in your loss.

  11. gomergirl says:

    Praying for Miss Kitty….
    And Have you seen the drivers up here in PDX? They may not DESERVE to pass, pass they apparently do…… {{{sigh}}}

  12. Steve Wright says:

    It was of course,followed with a chorus of amens to that statement in the comments.
    This is the passive aggressive way that this group has of trying to refute bad press and prop each other up to the end.It also provides another layer of shielding from any accountability for any actions.By implication, it attempts to destroy the credibility of those who bring criticism of one of their “brothers”.They will go to great lengths to protect the guilty because the guilty one is never guilty in their eyes… the fault lies solely on the one who brings the accusation.
    ——————————————————————————–
    I was a first hand recipient of this tactic. When I reached out to the veteran who made the comments, thinking he could not possibly know what I (and the many others at our church) actually knew, I was shocked to find out that he did know….and yet it really did not matter. Misplaced loyalty and let the sheep be sheared….

    Here is the simple truth.

    If the church I pastor is slandered, I will walk through fire and face any battle to stand on behalf of the dear faithful people who worship here.

    If I am personally slandered, I’ll let the Lord be my defense.

    A lot of these old-timers have that reversed. And as I have noted before, somehow despite now over 22 years, guys like me are still not “old-timers” to be listened to, even though the constant parade of veterans who were the voices when I was first saved had maybe 20 years themselves in the Lord at the time. Funny how that works.

    It’s like pudgy old Bartolo Colon telling guys in the MLB for over ten years that they still don’t know how to pitch…and only telling stories about pitching to Cal Ripken or Sammy Sosa

  13. Fisherman says:

    It seems some Calvary Chapel pastors see others as sheep, just poor little non-discerning sheep. These anointed ones can’t get over the word “sheep”. Now a man from India has pulled the wool over their eyes. To tell the congregation would admit the anointed ones were deceived. Oh no what to do?

    Love those 10 points listed above, especially #4.

  14. AA says:

    Michael praying for you & your favorite feline Miss Kitty.

  15. Michael says:

    Steve,

    That was well said.

    I will also say that despite our differences,Steve has always done that which was needed to protect his church and defend them.

  16. Michael says:

    Fisherman,

    The thing that is so very troubling to me is that they refuse to acknowledge this despite the fact that the people would still love them and trust them even more if they told the truth.

  17. Em says:

    i pray that Miss Kitty recovers and continues her duties in Michael’s life
    i know that when her time to answer God’s call home, yes, i think there’s a plan in God’s plan for the animals, when Miss Kitty’s time does come there’s a very good chance there’s another little critter is out there scared, hiding in the shadows and wishing it had a friend and a protector like Miss Kitty’s to see it through it’s time on this dark planet
    it is amazing how these creatures add to our lives … but isn’t that why God made them in the first place?
    God keep Miss Kitty and Michael, strong and safe

  18. Jeff Sheckstein says:

    Steve

    For the past 5 years and after leaving SoCal, I can honesty say (like I would otherwise lie), that while the many CC’s I’ve visited, attended, etc. are not megachuches and are likely small, they are (i) healthy, (ii) the pastors look to the HS to lead them and Jesus and Acts as the model, and (iii) could care less about the first and second generation of CC pastors. Their sheep know little of those pastors, most don’t know Chuck, and for the most part are fully engaged in their own church and the personal walk with the Lord.

    I suspect these evidences are seen at CCLE as well.

    As you may know, I would be sent by PC at times to investigate or lend legal and other counsel to these so- called “old-timers” and their churches. We both know that with a few exceptions, there is nothing to admire or commend with those fellows.

    Good for you and stand firm where the Lord has placed you. Your comments and perspective shared here are an encouragement to many, including me. I thank God that I could leave the “bubble” and sit with simpler and more Christ focused bodies. Truly there is still a remnant.

  19. uriahisaliveandwell says:

    #10 until then have no fellowship with them, lest you also become tempted orgiven to be compromise.
    Excellent Michael
    AMEN!!

  20. uriahisaliveandwell says:

    WOW, Michael. #6 is the crux or heart of what has quenched the HS.

  21. uriahisaliveandwell says:

    WOW, Michael. #6 is the crux or heart of what has quenched the HS.

    Keeps coming up as a duplicate, but not posting so if this does post double , my apologies.

  22. Steve Wright says:

    Thank you, Jeff and MIchael

  23. Twin Peaks says:

    Michael, you are in my prayers today. My heart hurts with yours. God knows and will bring the rescue and comfort. You are loved.

  24. Michael says:

    TP,

    Thank you, my friend.

    I took her to the doctor and she’s on antibiotics.
    We hope that fixes the problem…

  25. Linnea says:

    Praying for Miss Kitty.

  26. brian says:

    “Blessed are the merciful, for they shall receive mercy…” I remember when I really believed that though I still show mercy, a character flaw of mine I have come to really not to want mercy out of fear of crossing some line where it might be inconvenient or I am actually wanting it which makes me greedy and selfish. Its much more functional in the corporation to be anonymous and autonomous.

  27. Laura Scott says:

    I am praying for you and Miss Kitty.

  28. Surfer51 says:

    Michael,

    Please let me know if you will be needing some financial help with miss kitty and the vet.

    My wife and I are praying for a speedy recovery!

    David

  29. Surfer51 says:

    PS
    My eight cats wish her well.

  30. Disillusioned says:

    You had me until #10. This whole “family” talk is abused by churches who only use that language when it benefits them. If you ask one too many questions, you go from “brother” to “persona non grata” in a heartbeat.
    Other than that, I could have written every word. Thank you for doing it for me.

  31. Andrew says:

    ” It was God. Get your old, grubby, hands off His glory”,

    ________________________________________________________________________

    Yes, my thoughts exactly. However, I am finding it harder and harder to call what once was a revival if this is the fruit of it. So I don’t pray for revival, I pray for repentance. Let God do the revival part. And God probably does the repenting for us as well but this is what I am praying for.

  32. Dan from Georgia says:

    Wife and I prayed for Miss Kitty and will continue to pray!

  33. Pastor Al says:

    Typical Calvary Chapel stuff. There is no “there’ there in terms of really loving “God” and doing the right thing. It’s all about the Brand and the Corporation/Biz.

    That is their most consistent sermon and their loudest to those outside their cult bubble.

  34. Pastor Al says:

    It is who they are, they can’t help themselves. The so-called “TRANSFORMATION GOSPEL!” is a Myth…as mythical as the Tooth Fairy.

    Calvary Chapel Pastors are no different than any other walk of life, they are no more “transformed” than Bruce Jenner transformed into a woman.

    They are sinful men doing what they do. I’ve seen it first hand, even Chuck Smith himself…a total liar, lied so easy as if it was second nature.

    Don’t buy the bull. When push comes to shove the Calvary Chapel guys admit that when a Bob Coy falls from grace, “well, we’re all just sinners like you!” to excuse the behavior.

    Most of the time, however, they promote that they are “Special” and “Anointed!” until one of them can’t wiggle out of the scandal…then it’s “we are all sinners! He is without sin cast the first stone!”

    It’s really a great Con. You can play it either way and people are very lazy and stupid and fall for anything LOL

  35. Uriahisaliveandwell says:

    #35 see recent comment at other blog site. Made this AM.

  36. Michael says:

    Dan, Surfer, Laura, Linnea…thank you all for you prayers.

  37. Babylon's Dread says:

    What actually prompted #4? What provoked you to make this rebuke? Who do you think actually needs this caveat?

  38. Michael says:

    BD,

    There is a cadre of old guard guys who think they are the keepers of the flame that they lit.

    Trust me, they know who they are.

  39. Babylon's Dread says:

    I have heard those from the 60s who claim they are still in revival.

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